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Wednesday, May 17, 2006

Yeshiva Hagedolah Saudi Arabia?

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Have I got the perfect country for you!

Saudi Papers Told to Stop Showing Women

The king told editors on Monday night that publishing a woman's picture was inappropriate.

"One must think, 'do they want their daughter, their sister, or their wife to appear in this way?' Of course, no one would accept this," the newspaper Okaz quoted Abdullah as saying.

"The youth are driven by emotion ... and sometimes they can be led astray. So, please, try to cut down on this," he said.


Subway Sally said...

Let's not point fingers at others when we're doing the same thing ourselves, and for pretty much the same reason. I don't think that the (New York) "Jewish Press" newspaper ever shows pictures of women, either. Oy.

PsychoToddler said...

Exactly. It's this "Talibanization" of Judaism that just makes me crazy. There are people who are literally trying to drain every last bit of color from our lives until all that is left is this stark black-and-white world of Tairah.

They would fit in well in Saudi Arabia, but that's not what I signed up for.

ball-and-chain said...

The funny thing (if you can call the wholesale subjugation of women, funny) is that you can't see anything but women's eyes under their robes in most of Saudi Arabia. How would you actually tell it was a woman? You have to go all the way to the fringe of Judaism to find what is normative Islam today.

kasamba said...

Ball and chain; Now THAT is a fantastic point!!!!

But someone please explain to me how a floor legnth skirt isn't tznius???

PsychoToddler said...

I don't think there is anything even in the farest (?is that a word) fringes of right-wing Judaism that approaches the burka, but I think there are some people out there who would like to drive us in that direction.

Remember, the whole talmudic discussion on Kol Isha (a woman's [singing] voice) revolves around what is considered "ervah" or the equivalent of nudity, and this includes every exposed bit of skin, including the pinky.

As far as I know, we don't hold that pinkies need to be covered up, but we still stick with the restriction on women singing.

I like to think the whole discussion was more abstract, but obviously some bits seem to be taken literally.

Halfnutcase said...

as far as i know a floor length skirt is tznius. unless of course the untznius way of dressing that has become popular is not considered the only kind of tznius.

Subway Sally said...

Remind me to look up the words "sarcasm," "irony," "tongue-in-check," and "satire" when I get home. This sort of thing sails right over my head every time.

Ahem, meanwhile, back to the subject at hand. "Talibanization" is a pretty scary business. There have been tales on various blogs recently about kids being rejected for admission to yeshivot because their fathers actually worked for a living instead of studying full-time, their mothers wore denim, and the girls themselves were able to identify Elmo from "Sesame Street," thus proving that their parents let them watch television. As Steg said, "Hold on to your knit yarmulkas and jean skirts, Orthodox boys and girls, it looks like it's gonna be a bumpy ride..."

As for the rabbinic opinion that exposed pinkies are the functional equivalent of nudity, which led to the prohibition against a man listening to a woman sing, don't get me started. I've blogged about "kol isha" twice already, so you already know (from "round 2")that I think the whole prohibition is an insult to *men,* who are presumed to be incapable of controlling themselves. I said in my *first* post, way back in fall 2004, that I thought that those texts were taken way too literally, and lately, that seems to be even more the case. Will burkas be next?

ball-and-chain said...

SS: Yeah, that's a major problem with blogging, no one can tell when your kidding. I can't tell you the number of comments I've just deleted because I was sure that people wouldn't get that I was joking.
On Talibanization. You should come to Los Angeles, where anything goes. On a more serious note, I don't object (loudly) to people choosing any level of frumkeit that suits them. The thing that makes Islam more scary than Judaism (aside from the total disregard for human life) is that they force their will on others. As my brother was getting more and more frum, he chose more and more restictive communities in which to live. However, no one every beat his wife because her skirt was too short. Try walking the street in Iran with your hair showing.
I find the excesses of Orthodoxy pathetic and laughable, not frightening.
No jeans skirts? Pu-leese.

socialworker/frustrated mom said...

Yes it is pathetic of the Saudi's and us to.

Anonymous said...

this is pretty frightening

Iranian President Rejects European Incentives to End Uranium Enrichment